Lez Say More Podcast
Welcome to Lez Say More: the podcast where your favorite duo of best friends—together for over 20 years—gets real about the queer community. Join us every Wednesday as we dive into everything from health and wellness, to fashion, relationships, sex - and even the occasional celebrity gossip. With our trademark humor and brutal honesty, we’re here to share stories, laughs, and insights about the (queer) modern life and all the fabulousness it has to offer. Whether you're part of the community or just curious, grab your favorite drink and join the conversation—because we promise to keep it funny, relatable, and absolutely unfiltered!
Lez Say More Podcast
Sex-pectations A Lesbian Take On Sex, Toys & Taboos
On this weeks episode of the Lez Say More podcast we navigate the tricky terrain of gender roles in sexual relationships, sharing personal stories that reflect the confusion and discovery that come without the traditional "birds and the bees" talk. With open hearts and open laughs, we recount the missteps and learning curves of aligning personal feelings with societal expectations. This chapter offers a poignant look at the early stages of sexual self-discovery, underscored by anecdotes that are as amusing as they are insightful.
In a light-hearted exploration of intimacy, insecurities, and the playful world of sex toys, we dive into emotional connections that transcend mere physical attraction. The conversation takes a funny turn as we entertain the idea of 'field trips' to explore instant attraction and share our adventures with vibrators like "the snail." From the dynamics of being a top or bottom to the role of dirty talk, we paint a vivid picture of the joys and complexities of personal intimacy. Trust, communication, and a dash of humor steer this candid chat about the pleasures and pitfalls of exploring one's desires.
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What has shifted for you, though? Let's say more about it.
Speaker 2:Let's say more about it.
Speaker 1:I guess this is where I dropped the bombshell. What the f*** is the bombshell? Is someone about to walk in?
Speaker 2:No, no, no, so I that's a public. That's a kink that we found out Ava's kink. What about having sex in public turns you on when I was very little and then that was the kind of the way that I stuck to okay I don't even know if I want to share this, but no, be your true, authentic yeah, well, I don't know, this might get edited out.
Speaker 2:Um, hey guys, welcome back to the less say more. I am your host, solange, and this is your other host, ava. So today we are going to be chatting about sex.
Speaker 1:S-e-x, s-e-x, let's talk about sex baby, let's talk about you and me.
Speaker 2:Oh man, oh man, we got a lot to talk about. Yeah, we do, we do. We have written down some notes because we wanted to make sure that we stayed on topic, but also that we touched on a lot of the topics that we want to talk about and not forget any.
Speaker 1:Yeah because we do have ADD moments, so we need to make sure that we're on topic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and our producer isn't here today to keep us in check. So who knows what's going to happen.
Speaker 1:It's like a substitute teacher, and that's when you just act up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah you don't give a fuck. Who knows. This is not the episode to not have a producer on, and she can't preview it.
Speaker 1:She's going to have to watch like everybody else has to watch.
Speaker 2:Yep, I don't think she's gonna be happy about that. Well you know what?
Speaker 1:Sometimes you get what you get and you can't be upset.
Speaker 2:And that's what happens when you're sick.
Speaker 1:Take your vitamins, boys and girls, take your vitamins, take your vitamins.
Speaker 2:We're calling this episode Sexpectations, sexpectations. Say that three times Sexpectations, sexpectations, I think. I want to ask you first about your first sex experience. Okay, and was it what you thought it would be? And did you orgasm the first time you had sex With a woman?
Speaker 1:Yes, the first experience was with my college best friend from the basketball team. I don't know if I don't think I did orgasm. I honest to God don't remember, but I don't think I did. I think we were both so new to it that we didn't really know what we were doing. We just we thought we knew what we were doing. I'm really trying to like go back in time. It was good. It was like really innocent. You know, it was innocent, it was good. I think it made me fall in love with the woman, a woman's body, more, because they're softer and there's just a certain set I don't know how to explain like a smell that a woman has. I mean, don't get me wrong, not every woman smells great. Not every woman smells great, not every woman smells great.
Speaker 1:My experience was she did and she was soft and we were really gentle with one another and it's more we cared about. Like are you okay Not saying that again? This is no, like I don't want to keep having to say I'm not offending, so like I'm just not going to anymore.
Speaker 1:But, women just seem to like care more, like are you okay? Oh, did that feel good, did that hurt? And if you kind of feel like you're hurting your partner, you kind of like back off and you're like, oh, like I'm sorry, whereas I think other people might be too aggressive and may not care as much.
Speaker 2:Oh, I've been with some aggressive women. Oh, you have.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was not.
Speaker 2:That did not go over well no.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, see, I can't say that I have been in those situations, because that would be a huge turnoff for me. Same, yeah, I can't.
Speaker 2:Aggressive women turn me off. But there's a difference between aggressive and assertive.
Speaker 1:And assertive Like you can dominate me right to an extent, like you're not going to put a fucking ball in my mouth and have a leash and be like.
Speaker 2:Yes, why not?
Speaker 1:And spank me with a fucking whip Like I'm not getting spanked.
Speaker 2:Yeah, baby.
Speaker 1:No, I'm not.
Speaker 2:I'm not, don't knock it till you, try it, boo All right, I mean all right.
Speaker 1:Whatever I feel like I'm getting red, you are, you are.
Speaker 2:And we're only nine minutes in. Fuck me, I think we need another shot.
Speaker 1:Yes, we're sober in these cups.
Speaker 2:We're not in the cups in the kitchen. But no, so it was a very good experience to make me continue to want to explore more experiences with different women. Yeah, I'm trying.
Speaker 1:It was great. I don't have any I can't remember.
Speaker 2:I wish I could remember if I had an orgasm the first time. I mean, well, we'll talk about that later too. Oh okay, but my first experience was really scary for me. Why? Because it was my first girlfriend. I was 16. I didn't know what in the world.
Speaker 1:You lost your I can't say virginity it is my virginity? Well, no, because isn't virginity like if they break the wall?
Speaker 2:No, so there's your cherry. There's a technical term right so there's a technical term for sex, which would be intercourse, right, right. But OK, I guess that leads me to my question for you is what is gay sex to you? Like what is sex? Between two women Between two people of the same sex. Do you consider that sex? Is that? Is that sex to you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think. I think that when it's two people of the same sex having an intimate moment and they do some, they do, oh see, now I kind of feel like I don't know, because I was going to say when they penetrate each other, right, but then some women don't want that, they just want other sort of stimulation. So my, okay, my raw understanding of sex is is penetration. I think for me other sexual pleasures are just being intimate with one another.
Speaker 2:Okay, see, for me that is not true. For me, sex is two people engaged in a intimate interaction of intimacy. That includes anything with your freaking genitals. So that is penetration. That is giving head Sciss, that is giving head scissoring. That is scissoring, that is fingering, that is anything that involves somebody. Do like somebody's privates. Okay, being stimulated, okay. I don't consider it to only be sex if you penetrate someone, because if that's the case, then I've never had sex.
Speaker 1:Okay, I see, okay, I see it that I could see it that way. So, just you, just the arousal of two people. What if only one person's aroused?
Speaker 2:no, I wouldn't say arousal, I would say pleasure given to both parties or or one party. It doesn't matter. Like if one person is giving sex to another person. I don't think that that's not sex.
Speaker 1:So if I was giving pleasure right to someone but I wasn't receiving it, then would I say I did sex, or like how would I?
Speaker 2:I mean, I guess that also depends on your, your um understanding of sex, but also like what you consider to be sex, but also like what you and that person, or you and that partner, would consider to be sex, because I know, like for a guy and a girl, for example, if she gives him head, he's not going to consider that sex, right, he's just going to be like I got some head, yeah, I got it.
Speaker 1:I got some head, yeah, I got head, I loved it. I got some dome, some lettuce.
Speaker 2:But between two women, two women. That is part of sex.
Speaker 1:I don't know if giving head is Okay. Well, that's yeah.
Speaker 2:I don't know. I consider that to be sex. Now you guys can let us know in the comments or whatever.
Speaker 2:Like let us know if you consider that sex, but I think that's sex. Know in the comments, or whatever like let us know if you consider that sex, but I think that sex. I also think that it is it. It is easy to define sex as just penetration, because that's what we were taught and that's what we understand it to be by definition. But I think as um obviously people of the same sex explore each other's bodies. I don't think that that is not sex. Okay, so that's my interpretation of sex.
Speaker 1:We're all entitled to our own interpretation.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So for me, my first experience was very kind of I don't know. It was a little awkward, very awkward actually. Not even a little. It was very, very awkward. It was very awkward. It was uncomfortable. Very awkward actually, not even a little. It was very, very awkward. It was very awkward, it was uncomfortable. It was not at all what I thought it would be. I also never I never had the birds and the bees talk with my mom. I didn't either, because my mother, though my mother was very um open and she was a very sexual being, I guess, is the way I would describe my mom Like my mom was very open, like she would talk. Bless you, mom, but you're going to be on the podcast today.
Speaker 2:She was very open, Like she would talk about things and she would. You know she, my mom, had no filter when it came to talking about sex or any of those things she was very adamant about you get your pleasure. You know you this is not, but I think when it came to obviously, her gay children, I don't think she really knew that territory so.
Speaker 2:I didn't really have that talk with my mom. It was more like me trying to figure it out on my own and trying to understand what to do, you know, and in that it meant like watching porn and trying to understand what is lesbian sex and what do you do with a vagina. Because I also never, and we're gonna get personal here. I'm just gonna be open and blunt and and honest, because one shot of tequila does that to me. Wait, have I heard these stories before, since I don't drink very much?
Speaker 1:but poor at all.
Speaker 2:But I never masturbated in your traditional way.
Speaker 1:What the fuck are you talking about? What do you mean in your traditional?
Speaker 2:manner you know, like touching yourself. So how the fuck did you?
Speaker 1:masturbate.
Speaker 2:I. It was more like just like pressure, I don't know. It was really weird. It was like this it was the way I learned how to masturbate when I was very little, and then that was the kind of the way that I stuck to OK.
Speaker 1:I don't even know if I want to share this, and then that was the kind of the way that I stuck to. Okay, I don't even know if I want to share this, but no, be your true, authentic self.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, I don't know, this might get edited out Like I never touched myself.
Speaker 2:So I think until I was older, and then I kind of understood because I was also being more explorative of my body and trying to understand what felt good.
Speaker 2:But I think also because I had a lot of issues with gender identity, because for a long time when I was going through my teenage years, I thought maybe I wanted to be a boy and I didn't understand what it was to be a lesbian. I didn't understand what it was to like women and be a woman and also be masculine but also feminine and kind of like you know, and for me it was like oh, I am this way, so therefore I have to act this way, right, and being with my first partner, she was very masculine in her, in her like person, right, not not presenting. She was, was femme presenting, but she was definitely masculine inside and I was the opposite. So for me, my first interaction with sex with her and I feel like she had had experience that I didn't have it was very scary because I didn't know what I was doing and she just kind of crawled on top of me like a sexy crawl, though like a like a cat, like she was ready to pounce on her fucking prey.
Speaker 2:No, it was more like uh, like uh, I don't know it was. There was nothing sexy about it. She kind of just crawled on top of me and then humped me to death oh, she was like a bunny, like a humper yeah, and I was like I remember I was just laying there and I was like, was it rapid, what?
Speaker 2:yeah, and I was like, oh my god, is this supposed to feel good? And I'm like laying there and she's like humping me and at one point I don't know if this has ever happened to you, but like when your pelvic bone is so prominent and it is not rubbing the right area yes, that shit hurts, the bone hurts yes. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then it's sore later.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, and it's like rubbing and she's like getting in there and I'm like, oh my God, at this point I'm thinking if I moan, she's going to think it's pleasure and she's going to keep going. And it is not, it is pain, oh. And I'm like laying there and I'm like, oh my God, when is this going to stop? And that's all I kept thinking was like when is this going to stop? When is this?
Speaker 1:going to stop? Did you have your hands on her anywhere? Like, were you like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was really weird to me, but she had this thing with feet, wait. So she was totally naked and then had her socks on.
Speaker 2:She was naked and had her socks on, and I remember thinking like this is really like not at all what I thought this was going to be and I don't like it. So she finishes. I didn't ask her anything, I didn't, I just assumed that she had an orgasm. I have no idea. I mean, I didn't know what in the world that was supposed to feel like. So I was like whatever you're supposed to feel when this happens, I'm not feeling it, and so she kind of just got off of me and that was kind of the end of it and we, we, we didn't really talk about it do you feel like she was embarrassed?
Speaker 2:no, I mean we had, we've. We had sex a few other times, but it was just from that point on I thought that that's what sex was Like you just get dry, humped to just hump like a fucking bunny. Yeah, you hump like a bunny and your pelvic bone hurts.
Speaker 2:Yeah, your vagina bone is bruised for days on end and somehow that's supposed to feel good. I was like check, please. I'm done. I'm out of here. This, this is painful. I don't want to be a part of this yeah, no, I mean I I feel bad.
Speaker 1:That was your first experience that was my first experience.
Speaker 2:Did it get better ever at that?
Speaker 1:point with her. No so you had like a permanent bruise on your pelvic bone yeah, it got, it was definitely not did you have to?
Speaker 2:ice it after the bone. I don't think I ever thought to ice it, but that was a good idea. I I always had a very I've had a very like not a good relationship with intimacy, like I was always very scared to receive why I think for me it was partly because I guess this could lead into like gender roles. But for me I think that because I was always mask presenting and I was a more masculine one in the relationship, I had to be the giver. Also, because I was mostly with straight women, I felt like I had to I don't know like only give pleasure, because they wouldn't want to give me pleasure, because they hadn't been with women and maybe that wasn't something they wanted to do or they didn't know how and I didn't, I don't know. It's just it became this like, very like awkward thing with me and also I was super, super, super insecure about my body. That for me, being intimate with someone and getting naked and doing all that like I was like absolutely not. I guess that's also why I've never had a one-night stand, because I was just not comfortable with my body to put myself in that position with someone. I think for me, being somebody who always was the masculine one in the relationship, at least masculine on the outside.
Speaker 2:I always assumed that I was the one to give pleasure and I shouldn't receive pleasure. So you like, wouldn't let yourself go, I wouldn't let myself go, I would hold on to every thought possible. But don't get me wrong. What I would say which was true, because during that time I truly believed it was that that I enjoyed giving. Like that would get me off. Yeah, like I would say, don't worry about it. Like, don't worry about me, I enjoy giving like this. You know that turns me on, it gets me off. Like that's fine and girls were fine about it. Like, yeah, most of the girls I was with were OK with it, and I think it was also because they assumed I don't know, I think they didn't know any better. I have no idea.
Speaker 1:Honestly, I can't even speak for them because I don't know Should we ask them to comment, if any of them were listening, god, no, let her know how it made you feel when she said you know she's fine, she doesn't need anything. Let us know, let her know at her.
Speaker 2:yeah, let's not, why not? So that was my, I guess my hiccup with gender roles in a relationship, right like sexual gender roles, and I do think that there are a lot of other lesbians out there or queer people out there who feel the same way that because they are masculine presenting, they can't be femme in the bedroom. And I've learned that you 100% can be femme in the bedroom and there is no, there is nothing wrong with receiving pleasure, however that may be, because I do feel like sometimes some mask women will also won't receive penetration.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean yeah. I think also it comes. It has a lot to do with trust. I mean, yeah, trusting yourself, but also having a partner that you can trust, that you know you can let go, receive the pleasure and you can trust them, you feel safe with them. I've had experiences where I didn't trust my partner so I did hold back, and I've had experiences where I did trust and the trust comes with the dynamic you have with that person. I feel like it is important to let go. I think that we do over as women. We do overthink things a lot. I think that is our greatest, one of our greatest downfalls as women, and it's hard. So finding someone you could trust in the bedroom as well as out of the bedroom. But in the bedroom, being intimate, I think is one of the important things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree, I think that being open and communicating with your partner is super important, and this is only something that I've learned recently, because before, like I said, I didn't communicate. I never spoke up, I never said anything, I never told anyone if something felt good or didn't feel good. I kind of just went along with it and just did the deed and, you know, assumed that at some point you know, I don't know they'd catch on or I put it on them, which is wrong.
Speaker 2:I should enough, but also, I think that for me I didn't know any better because I didn't know what felt good for me. So I was always really good at giving, like really good at giving.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow but receiving was the hard part for me, because and I also stole that from the other women, because I feel like there are so many women that enjoy giving Right Just as much as you enjoy giving. They do, too, enjoy giving right Just as much as you enjoy giving. They do too and I took that from them because they didn't get to enjoy the giving part of our sex, because I wouldn't allow it.
Speaker 1:Shame on you. Are you going to apologize to all those women that you took those opportunities away from?
Speaker 2:Well, there's apologies, coming in in another episode. But what do you consider to be good sex?
Speaker 1:It's, I don't Wow. I think that that's a good onion, right, because, like people that are single, like if I were single, good sex could just be just sex, like, right, like, just like in the bathroom of a club or like in the car or don't look at me like, yes, those things have happened right.
Speaker 1:Or like, you know, in the kitchen or something like that, and I think those are considered good sex, like spur of the moment in a relationship. I think it's sometimes, I think, when you fall out of a connection with your partner, kind of coming back to home base by like having a good sex session where both of you orgasm, both of you, you know, make out with each other, not just like pecs, like make out and feel each other's like souls, kind of reconnect, and then after that you like cuddle or you feel each other's body. I think that's good sex too. Or I've also experienced it where, like, I haven't orgasmed but my partner has, and I would consider that good sex because in that moment I wanted to be the giver.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I'll be in a mood where I don't want to receive. I don't need to receive, let me just give it to you. That makes me feel better. I go through waves of that as well. I think that could be categorized as good sex for me too. Sometimes it's on the couch like spur of the moment, and you're watching a show and you're like, oh shit, oh, that turned me on. Yeah, I'm very like if I'm touching you or like close to you, like that can. That does it for you. That's enough, it can.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what's the best sex you've ever had?
Speaker 1:Oh, like I think, in the cars.
Speaker 2:Cars was the best sex you ever is. It because it was. What about it? Actually, let me ask you that what about having sex in public? Cause that's a public, that's a kink that we found out all this kink. What about having sex in public?
Speaker 1:turns you on. Just knowing that you're wanted by the other person in that moment, cause like no matter where you are, no matter where you on, just knowing that you're wanted by the other person in that moment, no matter where you are, no matter where you are, because we identify sex as not everyone, but you identify sex as, like you're in the bedroom, it's at night, the lights are off, you know you're ready for bed, right, but then like you're in the car and they get turned on and that's like like that feeds your ego, like I don't care who you are, that feeds your ego, right. Like when you're not. When you know you're wanted at any given time, you're like oh fuck, yeah, do you pull over or did?
Speaker 2:do you just like have sex as you're driving?
Speaker 1:I've done both oh, yeah, yeah, okay, okay, I don't think I've had. No, I have. Yeah, but I'm the driver, oh, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I've been. I mean, I've had a ton of sex in cars. Oh so you Well, because I mean, so that's your kink too? No, it was. I've had a ton of sex in cars because a lot of the time there was nowhere else to have sex.
Speaker 1:Yes, in cars, because a lot of the time there was nowhere else to have sex. Yes, yeah, I think everyone, everybody can relate to that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it was easy to have sex in the car. I I can. I can relate to that deep desire of just like wanting that person in that moment, not giving a fuck. Who's watching, who's around, and you're like I don't care, watch, take out your binoculars, I don't care, watch, take out your binoculars.
Speaker 2:I don't care, but then what do you consider good sex? For me, good sex is connecting with that other person on an emotional level, but also having like having that intimacy with that person, because for me I have a hard time separating sex from intimacy. Like I know, there are people who can have sex and just have sex and that is all it is. And we had sex, we fucked and goodbye. I don't have to ever see you again. I don't even know your name, whatever One night stands.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can't do that.
Speaker 1:Why.
Speaker 2:Let me rephrase that I've never done that. I don't know that. I don't know that I will never do that, but I just don't think that for me I've had the self-confidence in the past to one be intimate with somebody that I just met and also for me there is attraction that builds met, and also for me, there is attraction that builds.
Speaker 1:Oh so you? So your attraction builds, rather than like you can't look at someone and be like no, I can't.
Speaker 2:I can definitely look at someone and be like you're hot, yeah right.
Speaker 2:But I also, I think, get more aroused out of somebody that I can say, see, and say you're hot, hot, I want to get to know you and kind of like, connect with that person on that level, okay, and then explore it. But again, I don't. I've never really been in a situation where I've seen someone for the first time and been like you're hot, I want to take you home. Oh, like I. Just it's never happened. I've never. I've never seen someone and thought that.
Speaker 1:I, I've been there before. I've never acted on it. I, yeah, like I don't. I I would never go up to someone that I thought was attractive and say, or like, pick, pick them up. But like I've seen women before and I've been like, oh, they're hot, like I wonder you know how it? Would be. But yeah, maybe we need to get you out more, like take you to Silver Lake, have you explore it. Maybe do like what's it called Like go on a field trip.
Speaker 2:Oh, a field trip Right.
Speaker 1:I'll take the notes. You go ahead and do it. I'll be there, and now we'll have one of these so they know where we're from, and I'll just. I got you boo. I think we should do that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you'll be the lab rat and you're like you can only sleep with this person solely. You can't do anything else with them. Right, you got to go to the car. Go to the car, go to the car.
Speaker 1:I'll wait for you in my car. Yeah, go to the car, let's see how long it takes and just let me just report back.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:How long do you think sex?
Speaker 2:should last. Oh my God. I think it all depends on the person you're with and whether you're enjoying it or not, because, let me tell you, I have had sex with people and I prayed to baby Jesus that it ended Like the humper. Like, oh yeah, like the humper and others where I just hoped that it would end immediately, like before it even begun. You're like please?
Speaker 1:just, please just finish already.
Speaker 2:Or like just don't even touch me. That's brutal, yeah, that's brutal. That's why you don't get into relationships with people that you don't have an attraction for Really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's the problem. I agree there. I mean, I've always been a big proponent Is that the word yeah, proponent of being attracted to someone.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, I just think that sometimes you try to get into a relationship with somebody because you think they're a good person and they check all your other boxes right, but the physical attraction part isn't necessarily 100% there. But I feel like that then becomes a problem later on, because then you're like, okay, well, I'm not physically attracted to you and and then other issues start to arise. You know, so I've been in relationships like that where I've haven't been fully physically attracted to the person and I then, you know, do stupid shit.
Speaker 1:How many times a week do you think you should have sex?
Speaker 2:I think there's a statistic right. But I think, as many times as your little heart desires. I personally think maybe two times a week is pretty healthy. I think there is a stat that said two to three times a week is the average. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think I have some things to say about that later. I think ideally we would like it two to three times a week. I think sometimes it gets hard and there's other reasons. I think why other factors that come into play, especially if you are in a longer term relationship, if there's kids involved, if there are careers involved. I think it's easier when you don't have those things happening and you don't have those sorts of responsibilities. Your mind is less cluttered with tasks that you believe you need to do.
Speaker 2:We kind of wanted to share some stats with you guys, and Ava is going to share some with you that she pulled up.
Speaker 1:It's about a woman's libido. More women than men struggle from erectile dysfunction and people don't think women can suffer from something like that Because when you hear it, you automatically hear you think of men, right, but 43% of women struggle, compared to 37% of men. There's also drugs or medication that's geared towards men and this problem that they have, whereas recently only a couple have hit the market for women. So there's not much value that women feel there is when it comes to sex for them or to feel pleasure. 40% of women report low libido. You know men at times look at sex as like a stress reliever, like okay.
Speaker 1:I'll just, I'll finish and and then that's it. Whereas women again, women with families take on a lot more, you know, they have to feed the kids, they have to make sure the kids are picked up, whether they're doing it or their partner, the house needs to get clean, their careers, or if they're stay at home mom, that's a whole other job in itself, you know. So when it comes to sex, they can view it as it's another task. Oh God, I have to do this and I have to get ready for it, and I, you know whatever getting ready for it means for them.
Speaker 1:So if you're feeling that way, the greatest thing to do is express that to your partner and then have them take some of that off of your plate. You know, because sex is supposed to be enjoyable, it's supposed to feel good for both people, right? Also, sleep is very important, the quality of sleep. So it's known that if you get at least seven hours of good quality sleep, it helps with your testosterone, and women have more testosterone than estrogen. Yeah, and testosterone is a hormone, and it's the feel-good hormone, it's your sex hormone, it is your sex hormone.
Speaker 2:And I but estrogen is your wet hormone. It is.
Speaker 1:But sometimes they say that lubrication doesn't always mean you're turned on, because women that just gave birth can't get wet as easily. But that doesn't mean they're not turned on, they just can't produce down there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, same as, like women, once you start getting into that perimenopausal stage, your hormones drop, your libido drops and there is hormone replacement therapy. There are things you can do, there are things that you can discuss with your OBGYN to help and to really try to boost your libido, because I think everybody should be having sex and enjoying getting pleasure out of life yeah, at any age, whether it's it's to produce children or just for pleasure. So I do think that knowing that you're getting into the stage should not mean oh well, there goes my sex life and I'm okay with it, but a lot of women think that yeah, you know, and that's why there's these tools.
Speaker 1:Right and like, exercising helps with that because it helps release testosterone. Right, a diet? A good? Whatever the good diet is for you. I'm not here to tell anyone what their diet is, but I can attest to the sleep part, because I wasn't getting good quality sleep and recently I started to get better quality sleep and it has changed my libido and I've seen an increase in it. So just, you know, people should just try it out.
Speaker 2:But you know it's like sometimes it's taboo to be like I have a low libido Because some women don't want to admit that it's slowing down for them and it could be a lot of different things and I think the stress of and I think that we are such mental creatures in the sense that we hold everything in and then it affects our mindset and then we're not in the mood because we're thinking about this, we're thinking about that, and then you're just not even like wanting to have sex. I mean, how many times have you had sex and you've been thinking about something?
Speaker 1:else. Well, not only that. Think about this when you're in your honeymoon phase of your relationship, you're always having sex, right? Well, because you're not worried about much, right? Then you get into the relationship, you're like fuck, did I pay that bill? Oh my God, we still need to do this, yeah.
Speaker 2:What's for dinner?
Speaker 1:He or she pissed me off. And they talk about makeup sex and how great that can be. And yes, it can be great. But there are some times where you're like, fuck that, I'm not like, I'm turning my back Right and although like in a fairy tale world, is it great to have makeup sex? Yes, I've had it, it's great. But then some people might think, if I give in to you, then I'm letting you know that that behavior that you did is okay.
Speaker 1:And sometimes you want to prove a point. So it's like what's the balance? Should you just let go and just have the sex and then say sorry later, or do you stick your ground?
Speaker 2:That's a good one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree. When do you think is a good time to introduce toys, and not your like Ken and Barbie, toys like your like?
Speaker 2:sex toys like your bunny. We're getting into the good stuff. We're gonna start talking about sex toys yeah, fuck, I don't, I didn't oh well, I haven't seen you this excited in a long time.
Speaker 1:I like toys. You know what? Maybe we should always give you a shot of tequila before we do these?
Speaker 2:oh no, I don't even feel it. I feel the heat, though, is hot. I feel hot, it's not menopause. It's, no, it's the tequila and the lights, but all right. So toys, I I am big on toys, I love toys, I think that toys are fun, but again, I will say this because I'm sure I have exes on that would be watching and be like what. We never use toys Because she didn't trust y'all.
Speaker 2:No, it's not about trust. I think it was. There are certain. I think you have to feel comfortable with a partner and you also have to be open to exploring certain things that make you vulnerable. And toys make you vulnerable, like it is definitely something that, especially in a lesbian community, where toys are very popular, very commonly used, you know they have. There's dildos, there's vibrators, there's all kinds of toys. There's the infamous strap on. There are, there are strap ons, and I think that toys are definitely healthy. I think toys are definitely fun. They're a great way to spice things up if your sex life is kind of dull and boring. My experience with sex toys the first time.
Speaker 1:Do you have a toy chest? I have a toy drawer. Oh, so you have a toy chest. I have a toy drawer. Oh, so some, you don't have enough to have a chest yet, or is your drawer really big?
Speaker 2:no, let's, let's, let's, let's, let's. Uh, let's talk about toys, boo. So so I have so many questions, I don't even know where to start. Okay, first, and have you used toys?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I'm not an expert. I don't have a drawer or a chest have you used.
Speaker 2:Okay, what's your favorite toy?
Speaker 1:I don't have a favorite toy. You don't have a favorite toy. No, I will tell you this. That is a part I struggle with. I'm being honest. It is I struggle with toys and I don't know psychologically why that is. I don't know why I don't allow myself to be more vulnerable to them, but there's like a blockage for me. Is this having toys used on you or you using toys? Both?
Speaker 2:Okay, I feel like maybe it has to do with. I don't think I'm good enough. Is this having toys used on you or you using toys?
Speaker 1:Both. Okay, I feel like maybe it has to do with I don't think I'm good enough. Yeah, see, there's a whole different, deeper level.
Speaker 2:Okay, we're unpacking this because if I have to edit this into four parts, we're doing it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so let's explore this because I think this is a good topic to talk about, because I think there are a lot of women out there who probably feel the way you do and who felt the way I did, which we'll talk about. But what is it about? And now, when we talk about toys, especially in the lesbian community, a lot of it is generated towards strap-ons and dildos. Yeah Right, generated towards strap-ons and dildos, yeah Right. So what is it about using a strap-on or a dildo as you wearing it, not you receiving, but you giving?
Speaker 1:that would make you feel insecure that they would want to be with a guy. Okay, yeah, that's what I thought it was. So the female anatomy doesn't have we're clearly two different anatomies, right? So for me, if you're seeking pleasure or getting way more pleasure out of like a strap on, I'm going to get in my head and I'm going to automatically think that you miss having sex with a guy or you're craving having sex with a guy.
Speaker 1:I can do vibrators. I can do that because obviously a male's penis doesn't vibrate, right. So, like it is a different sort of sensation that women do like, and so I've, you know, that's that's the diff, the difference for me and I'm just being completely, completely honest about how it makes me feel, and I've, I've had this for since I've been with women, so it's not like a new revelation for me. That's just what it is and that's my blockage and I have been stubborn about it, like I have been stubborn to the because I don't want to feel that insecurity, because it is different. Like men provide something that a woman can't and vice versa. Right, there's no other way. That's just the reality of things. I don't want to walk around this earth feeling like, damn, does she want that? You know if it was just maybe, if it was a girl that I didn't know that much or didn't care about, maybe. But no, I mean honestly it's. It's not something I've ever wanted to do.
Speaker 2:Do you think that that insecurity stems from the fact that well, I don't even want to say the fact, because I don't know if this- is true or not, but has this happened to you? I guess it's a question to ask with this question, but that they would go back to men. So you've been with women that have gone back to men?
Speaker 1:Yeah, maybe I would probably have to like really sit and think about why that is, but not necessarily go back to men. Maybe be like being with me, but then in the back of their head thinking about a man.
Speaker 2:So to you penetration equates.
Speaker 1:Not penetration with my fingers Right, but penetration with a toy. Having a toy that resembles Okay. Male genitalia.
Speaker 2:Yes, okay, that's interesting?
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, yeah, not like I'll, you know, do it with my hand all day long. And what about receiving? No, I don't, I don't, I don't. Nothing in me has ever wanted to be fucked with a dildo. No, no, no, I don't. And that's like the honest truth, Like it's never, I've never even been like, oh well, maybe.
Speaker 2:Oh, and what if?
Speaker 1:what if she was like this is something I've always wanted to do I've had that and I've stuck my ground even if it's with somebody that you truly like, like your wife, like somebody that true like if fernanda came to you and said babe, I really want to try this, this is something I want to do with you I think her and I have had the conversation before and she knows I will go to like a sex shop with her and I've told her plenty of times let's go and let's, you know, pick things out, but I'm not picking out a strap on and we'll, you know, we'll get as many vibrators as you want, like I'm even down for you know the rabbit where it's like the two in one, those like I'm open to, but I'm not doing anything that you know potentially can resemble.
Speaker 1:That's so funny, we're so different, and it's not because, you know, like Fernando or my partners have been with men, like it's, even if they were gold stars like you, I think it would still. It's still like it's an Ava thing and it's, even if they were gold stars like you, I think it would still. It's still like it's an Ava thing and it's it's not.
Speaker 2:No one's made me feel it it's not, it's not necessarily an Ava thing, because there are a lot of women out there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a lot of people out there who probably feel the same way. Yeah, correlate that with you. Know, if you're going to want this and you're going to want to go be with a guy, right, or what's the difference? Yeah, you know what I mean, so I understand that point of view. Yeah, um, for me that's not the case. Like I enjoy it. Yeah, I enjoy wearing a strap on. I enjoy giving. I enjoyed all of it. I enjoy you have.
Speaker 1:Like, you're like bde oh, yeah, yeah, oh shit, all right sully.
Speaker 2:But, like to me, I don't, I don't know, I don't correlate, like me, having sex with you with wearing a strap on to you, wanting to have sex with a guy. I'm wearing a penis, right, and that's an air quotations for those listening doesn't mean that it would match sex with a man, right, because, well, because sex with a man is so vastly different than sex with a woman, right, in the sense that we're not hairy beings, we're not. You know, there's that sensuality. We have boobs, at least you know, yeah, we have boobs. Women presenting women have boobs.
Speaker 2:You're not gonna, unless you're having sex with a transgendered person. You're not gonna have a penis and boobs and a waist, and you know what I mean, like the the sensuality, the femininity of having sex with a woman. But you're getting the added pleasure of having penetration from a dildo, right From, like this penis, and also the added benefit that it is with a partner that you connect with and that you're either in love with or have, like this sexual attraction to right. So I think all those different layers is what makes it different than having just having sex with a man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can see that I think for me. Maybe I just I always think, not always. I do think at times that like what if they want something different than me? And that's always been me in a relationship, right I?
Speaker 2:mean, but that goes to all these other layers. Yeah, that's what I said. It's like the onion, right?
Speaker 1:So, but that's, it's an onion, but my compromise is we can go to the store, we can get things.
Speaker 2:So do you believe in getting new toys with new partners?
Speaker 1:like what like?
Speaker 2:okay, like, let's say, you have a new partner and you do you keep the toy that you had before or do you go and get a new toy?
Speaker 1:go get a fucking new toy. Why hell no, hell no?
Speaker 2:there. Listen, there is toy etiquette and there are people who don't, people who say, well, I boiled that shit, so it's good to go. I paid a lot of money for it. I'm gonna use it for somebody else, no, then spend that money again on the new person and also I think it's so much fun to go to a sex store with whoever you're dating, like your partner, have you?
Speaker 1:ever tried poppers.
Speaker 2:No, I have not Explain what poppers are.
Speaker 1:They are. It's like this little tube, or, yeah, like a tube, and God, I don't remember if you I think you smell it right you inhale it. I think you smell it right, you inhale it and it gives you like sort of like a helium high or some sort of high, and it's created for gay men to loosen up. Oh, for anal penetration? Yeah, so Fern and I I think she's the one that, like, told me about- it.
Speaker 2:Oh Fern, is she insinuating something I don't remember?
Speaker 1:It was a while ago. I think I still have some. They're probably expired. But we didn't, we just were curious and we tried it and I remember like it was like I just sucked out of helium, a balloon with helium, but I don't know for men, I don't. It didn't loosen me up because you were already loose. Oh my god, wow, um, but yeah, I, I don't know. Maybe you should like try it and see how it make you feel. Just so that, because it didn't make me feel interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's it'd be interesting to see how it makes you feel.
Speaker 2:I my experience with toys and I have I don't have like a huge chest of toys and different toys, but for me, for example, I get zero pleasure out of vibrators well, is it on the right spot?
Speaker 2:I hope so, yeah, but I just don't. I fucking hope it's on the right spot. I don't you. Let me tell you so. The first, the first time I ever tried to use a vibrator, oh my god, I was like what the fuck is this supposed to do? Right? Like I was like all right, whatever. I got one for I don't know. It was like in a gift thing that somebody gave me and it did absolutely nothing, like nothing. And I put it on all the settings, like I went from zero to 100. And I felt like my poor clip was going to fall off at 100. And I was like there is no way that any of this is, I get no pleasure out of it. Like I don't know if it's, and I and I'm sure I'm not the only one I'm sure that there are ways of stimulation that are just too much for some people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but like it has to be on like do you, do you know where your G spot is? Well, your G spot is like an area, yeah, right, so like it's supposed to be like yeah, within that area, yeah yeah, yeah, and when it was on there, did you apply your own pressure on it?
Speaker 2:yes, and for me pressure is a big thing. Like right, I'm very sensitive to pressure, I'm very. That's why, like, grinding for me doesn't do anything either. But grinding for you, like scissoring which I've never done doesn't do anything either.
Speaker 1:But grinding for you, like scissoring, which I've never done, doesn't do anything for me, but grinding like if they're on top of you, right, you're on the bottom and you elevate your pelvis area. Yeah, no, nothing. But if their lips are on yours, nothing, boo.
Speaker 2:Nothing. It doesn't do anything for me. That and listen, so what does it? Maybe, maybe I need to just keep practicing and see what happens. I'm all I'm. I won't drop this bombshell on you just yet, but oh, there's a fucking bombshell there's a there's a bombshell today and we're not talking about love island bombshells but no.
Speaker 2:But I think that you know, finding your own, exploring your own body and finding what feels good to you was something that I didn't do until I was older, because I had a one way of feeling good and that was the way that worked for me and that was what I stuck to right throughout my youth. Way that worked for me and that was what I stuck to right throughout my youth. And when I started to have sex with partners, I realized that I was so in my head that for me I couldn't get pleasure and it felt difficult for me to reach certain levels of comfort. I guess I would say levels of comfort, I guess I would say, to really explore more. And I think that that's why I was always considered myself a giver rather than a receiver. Using toys for me was always fun because I don't know like I got a lot.
Speaker 1:I will say I definitely got off giving for me, I think you need to find the right vibrator, though.
Speaker 2:Listen. Have you tried the snail? No, it sounds slow does it go like?
Speaker 1:real like there is no slow I'm gonna have to get you one. There's this vibrator, it's called the my wedding already happened actually, I don't know what it's called, but my bachelorette party already happened. You don't need to get me a sex toy it's called it's.
Speaker 2:I call it the snail. I don't know if that's what it looks like a snail and apparently I don't know if I want cargo on my vagina this little snail can send you to the moon and I've seen it happen on yourself. No, I used it on a partner and it shot them to the moon Like, literally. I had never seen their like a body react the way that her body reacted, that she literally leaped and fell into my nightstand.
Speaker 1:I'm imagining all of this Like like, leaped, leaped.
Speaker 2:Fernanda's watching this episode and she's like solange fernanda's like 100, but I've never seen it and like her body like convulsed, like it was the most bizarre experience I've ever had with this little freaking thing. How small is it it is? It's like, probably like that big, I don't know Probably like, maybe like two to no bigger than we should have had a chest of sex toys today. Oh for sure, we can, we can definitely pull it out. Yeah, we can definitely talk about toys more and and and do a whole show.
Speaker 2:show on toys, but the snail the snail is where it's at, apparently. If you're into and do a whole show on toys, the snail. The snail is where it's at, apparently If you're into vibrators. I'm not into vibrators, but like being used on me. But if I'm using a vibrator, I mean that's a vibrator to use. All right, snail the snail. All right, strap-ons and snails. So you're the strap-on. S and S.
Speaker 1:S andS. So you're the strap s and s, s and s, s and s what's, uh, what's your favorite position, because you know we're on the topic.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, um, are you a bottom or a?
Speaker 1:top boo, I answer this in rapid fire. Yeah, but now we're elaborating. Yeah, we are. I used to be a top and then it just became too much work. No, it just fucking.
Speaker 1:You know, fernanda's just, she's just assertive, like you know. But, um, I mean, we do switch off, but but most of the time I'm the bottom. To be completely honest with you, I can't say that always is is the go-to, because sometimes, like it's it's not for me but it is for her, because sometimes I don't need to climax, I just want her to just anything that's like sensual, like I'm very big on, like I need to like kiss you too. Right, it's, it's not like I don't want us just to lay there and then to do it, because I feel like, oh, you're just, you're just doing it. Like I want to feel her kiss me like my neck, I want to kiss her, so like if she's on the side of me and you know her hands are wherever, then that's a good position too. So I can't say like I have a favorite one. I just I don't know. Do you like dirty talk? Yeah, I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1:That's like are you the talker, I'm, it's both. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I for me personally like dirty talk. I love it, it's like I won't call me a bitch, though.
Speaker 2:Like don't be like, yeah, I won't climax like as quickly if there isn't any Like. Could you, could you ever be with some? Have actually, you know what? Have you ever been with someone who was just silent and didn't, didn't say or do?
Speaker 1:anything. Probably my first six, my first girlfriend. We probably both were silent. I again it. It's hard to remember those times. It was so long ago, but just thinking about her as a person like I just don't think we both were like vocal. I probably also wasn't very comfortable with a lot of things then.
Speaker 2:So she may be the only one. Would you be with someone, Okay? So what would your reaction be if you were with someone who was completely quiet during sex?
Speaker 1:Oh, actually I have had one, I have had someone like that. It was the biggest turnoff, the biggest turnoff. I was like not like I was good, like no, we're good.
Speaker 2:What did you say? Did you stop it? Did you stop in the middle of sex and were you like, okay?
Speaker 1:I need you to say something. Talk to me, bitch. No, no, no. I just stopped and said I was tired. That leads me to my next question have you ever fallen asleep or had someone fall asleep on you during sex? Yes, both.
Speaker 2:I'm sure this is more common than we think.
Speaker 1:I was fucking tired. All right, like I was fucking tired, right, like I was fucking tired. And then, when they fall asleep, they were fucking tired. Well, they were tired and drunk. See, like that's, those are the two like worst combinations, right, because, because alcohol is a sedative, right, so you're definitely like, if you get to a certain limit, you go home. You're tired, like you're, it's better to just go to sleep, right, you're gonna pass out, you're gonna pass out. So, yeah, like it's happened to me, I've done it. I it's a horrible feeling. You feel guilty because you make the person not feel desirable and vice versa, like I was. Like are you fucking kidding?
Speaker 2:how did so? Tell me, how did that happen? So were you like going down on her and then all of a sudden you're like why is she not? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then I looked and then she was sleeping. But it's happened a couple of times and I'm not going to lie to you. I think one of the times I was kind of relieved it happened because I was tired too, I was ready to go to sleep. I was like, yeah, good, thank the Lord, baby Jesus, I didn't want to hurt my neck. Oh man, I can't have you ever fallen asleep.
Speaker 2:I've never fallen asleep, have you had them fall asleep. I'm trying to think. I don't think I've ever had anyone fall asleep on me. Oh, so good for you. What's?
Speaker 1:the longest you've had sex for. I don't know if I like check the time, but I remember it being like more than 10 orgasms in a setting and this went on for how long? It had to have been over an hour, no right An hour is the longest, probably. Oh my God, why that's too short of a fucking time for you.
Speaker 2:No, but I mean like I don't know, I just think like when you first start dating someone, you always have those nights where you go for like I don't know.
Speaker 1:I mean, your tongue doesn't get fucking raw Solange you don't get it fucking.
Speaker 2:Especially if you use toys. Okay, or strap-ons.
Speaker 1:Well then, maybe that's the thing.
Speaker 2:I don't know, maybe like five, six hours where the fuck were you in my bedroom on my bed you know that bed you were sitting on the other night. Fuck hell no five, six hours but this has been with more than one partner that I've had. Have you had the ogre throuple? No, not at one time. Have you ever had a threesome?
Speaker 1:Yes, I was young.
Speaker 2:I was young. Who's talking shit about me? I didn't even have a threesome.
Speaker 1:It wasn't a throuple, though it was like but please say more.
Speaker 2:It was like let's say more about this. It was like no, I want the whole thing, the details and everything.
Speaker 1:It was, I was very young.
Speaker 2:Okay, very young.
Speaker 1:Whatever. And it was two girls and me. And were these two random people? No, no, no, it was people that I knew I wasn't dating one yet One of the. I ended up dating one of the girls After, after, like not right after. I was like, oh, it was so good, will you be my girlfriend? I didn't do that. It was like a little while after, and we drank a little too much and then, you know, we all just started touching each other and one thing led to another, and it was oh my, my God, how was it.
Speaker 1:It was fun. I mean I would probably. I don't if I was single. I probably wouldn't do it again because it can get complicated with feelings and oh, but that's you assuming that it's going to continue. Yeah, I think it. For me it was like it happened. It was cool the one time. I never desired it again after that. Um, it was just that one time, and see I have never so that thruple.
Speaker 2:Yeah that you keep insinuating that I was in. I'm not insinuating I, I it. We and becky with the good hair can probably remember this we had kind of started the attempt to I can't even picture this.
Speaker 2:To have a threesome. And this was in my like bedroom. In my I lived with my parents cause I was young, I was like 17. Oh my God, in my I lived with my parents because I was young, I was like 17, oh my god. And um the the it started to kind of happen. And then, honestly, and I cannot remember for the life of me as to why we stopped, but I think and she can correct me if I'm wrong that it was because first girlfriend freaked out. Why? Because she was very controlling, yeah, and she wanted to be the center of attention. So I think her ideal situation would have been like both of us pleasuring her.
Speaker 1:Gross, she's so gross.
Speaker 2:And we were like no, because we were really into each other, so we were having a good time, yeah. And then she was kind of like okay, this isn't going to work, and I think she's the one that stopped it, if I remember that correctly. I could be, I could be missing some parts to that story, but that's the way I remember it and I remember thinking, oh, my god, like she, she's gonna lose her mind if we get to like, if we actually go through with this, just because she was so like, so controlling yeah, she was. I mean, our clothes didn't even come off, it was just literally just the beginning stages of like making out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'd be open to it. Any volunteers? Any volunteers.
Speaker 2:I think I would be a lot more open to things now in this time in my life than I was younger, because there's a lot of things that have happened in the last couple of years of my life that have shifted sex for me, and I think that that is what's made it all more fun.
Speaker 1:I guess I would say what has shifted for you, though? Let's say more about it.
Speaker 2:Let's say more about it.
Speaker 1:I guess this is where I drop the bombshell. What the fuck is the bombshell? So I'm about to walk in.
Speaker 2:No, no no, so I guess for me, is it getting serious?
Speaker 1:Are we about to have a serious talk?
Speaker 2:No, I mean yes. At some point this is gonna turn into a serious conversation, but I didn't have an orgasm until recent, like until the last couple of years. You had your first. I had my first orgasm in the last couple of years, and with who? Oh just, we'll just leave that as a mystery for now. We're gonna call her miss o, with miss o. Yes, miss o gave me my first orgasm that's really shocked, that that I don't even know what to say.
Speaker 2:Well, we're going to talk about it because this episode is going to leak over into episode two and or the next episode part two of this episode and we're going to talk about orgasms, and I think I'll share a little bit more about my story, because I do think that there are a lot of women out there, like me, who haven't had an orgasm or who thought that they were broken and lied and didn't fit, and they probably faked it, faked it and they were never honest about having orgasms, and all the women that they were with before or men or whatever, probably partners thought that they were the ones that gave them the orgasms. I definitely think that that is something worth talking about and sharing more on. So we're gonna we're gonna leave that for next week's episode, all right.
Speaker 1:All right, I mean I'm I can't wait, I'm gonna ask you off air, I'm gonna bother you.
Speaker 2:All right.
Speaker 2:All right, I think we're gonna wrap this one up. We're gonna. We're gonna put a bow on this one and wrap it up. Next episode we're going to continue the conversation about orgasms and sex and we're going to tell some funny sex stories, and I think Ava's got a few that we're going to hackle over. Thank you so much for listening and watching. We truly appreciate it and I really hope that you guys got some valuable information out of this episode, even if it was just a couple of laughs at our us a DM, shoot us an email. We're more than happy to talk about it on the podcast. At some point we will be having guests on, but hopefully you know you got something out of this episode and you're going to get something more out of next week's episode when we talk about the big O.
Speaker 1:And Miss O, and Miss O.
Speaker 2:And Miss O and Miss.
Speaker 1:O All right guys.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for watching. We appreciate you. Don't forget to rate the show, Comment, subscribe all the good stuff. You can also follow us on Instagram and TikTok. Let's say more. So thank you so much and we'll catch you guys on the next one. Bye Later, booze.
